POLL: Which Elephant shirt do you prefer?

Joined: 19 Jul 2005 Posts: 5828 Location: Los Angeles, CA

I am going to try out this polling thing. Your answers will have no effect on my business plan, but I am curious to know what the vocal minority that cares enough to respond thinks!

Old shirt:

New shirt:

And also this for reference:

Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 1:17 am

I like the one I don't already own you conniving bastard.

Joined: 15 Jan 2008 Posts: 1580

The old shirt - it's "sportier."

Joined: 08 Dec 2005 Posts: 9009 Location: SOMEWHERE EXTREME

I like the new design 'cause it's more Soviet, but I don't like how it's wordier.

Joined: 08 Dec 2005 Posts: 9009 Location: SOMEWHERE EXTREME

Also I would love to see a shirt that only says "IRONIST" because it would be the most unironic shirt ever? EXCEPT THAT AN IRONIST WOULD WEAR IT IS IRONIC IN ITSELF?!?!?!

WOAH!

Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 4:09 am

I like the original more because it's sort of more simple and I prefer centered designs usually, but I like the new one more because it's got more oomph and more visual interest.

Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 9:00 am

the second one gets questioned at the airport

Joined: 06 Jun 2008 Posts: 11

I always preferred the "original" one that was on the brown shirt. I like the old design but I don't like ringer shirts.

ten out of ten · Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 10:31 am

Dezro wrote:

I like the new design 'cause it's more Soviet, but I don't like how it's wordier.

i agree

Joined: 19 Jul 2005 Posts: 5828 Location: Los Angeles, CA

As for the wordier bit on the new shirt, I wish the Russian worked out to be a little more visually interesting, but for some reason I think it's really funny to have a line of boilerplate in a foreign language.

If anyone wants to still pick up one of the older shirts, this is the best chance you're gonna get: all old stock is on clearance for $10 a shirt.

http://wondermark.com/wm_store.html#apparel

Joined: 19 Jul 2005 Posts: 16347 Location: TaBB Graveyard

i feel like i'd have to see someone wearing the new one too but that probably won't make a difference
they both have their appeal
sad that i bought a men's size of the old one i never wear it cause its big

Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 12:31 am

I do like that the one I already have has script that looks more "Russiany".

Joined: 19 Jul 2005 Posts: 5828 Location: Los Angeles, CA

Yeah, the serif font reads as Russian a little easier. (It's also the same font used for the Borat subtitles.) But the new one's very mid-century Soviet/constructivist. I copied some of the forms and the color palette from some posters I picked up in a Russian bookstore a long time ago.

Some people started getting on the Futurism poster for using ugly fonts. I had to tell 'em, man, they're the exact same fonts as in the stuff we're parodying! It's precisely BECAUSE that old stuff used those fonts that they seem cliché today.

that is sort of a separate issue. the point is that I try pretty hard for verisimilitude when parodying something! same deal with the fonts in the newer Wondermark books.

Joined: 19 Jul 2005 Posts: 16347 Location: TaBB Graveyard

i like the new font more

Joined: 19 Jul 2005 Posts: 5828 Location: Los Angeles, CA

AndyClark wrote:

i feel like i'd have to see someone wearing the new one too but that probably won't make a difference
they both have their appeal
sad that i bought a men's size of the old one i never wear it cause its big

andy you and sneaky gave me such a warm positive feeling when you bought some of the very first run of those shirts. That MoCCA '06 show was the first time I'd ever sold shirts and the fact that you guys bought them made me feel like I was maybe doing okay. I feel bad, looking back, that they were not the greatest shirts (size-wise etc. for you). but thank you all the same.

Joined: 19 Jul 2005 Posts: 16347 Location: TaBB Graveyard

i still love it a whole bunch i'm glad it gave you a nice feeling :)
i wear it sometimes it is just pretty big on me so not THAT often

Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 1:21 am

Maybe I'm missing something, but what does the small text on the new one say?

Joined: 19 Jul 2005 Posts: 16347 Location: TaBB Graveyard

right there in the center

Joined: 13 Jun 2008 Posts: 1108 Location: PA

darthkittenlover wrote:

Some people started getting on the Futurism poster for using ugly fonts. I had to tell 'em, man, they're the exact same fonts as in the stuff we're parodying! It's precisely BECAUSE that old stuff used those fonts that they seem cliché today.

That's just silly. I'm a huge type/font nerd, and I thought it was a-ok.

Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 10:18 am

I like the new one. It seems like it can somehow more easily get away with not making sense, just cause it looks cool.

Also Malki ! I wanted to let you know that I still wear my Approved for All Audiences shirt all the time and people still get a kick out of it.

Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 11:39 am

darthkittenlover wrote:

Some people started getting on the Futurism poster for using ugly fonts. I had to tell 'em, man, they're the exact same fonts as in the stuff we're parodying! It's precisely BECAUSE that old stuff used those fonts that they seem cliché today.

I-I didn't want to say anything before...but yeah, the fonts didn't work for me on that poster.

I dig the new red shirt though! I like the old shirt design too, but I never would have gotten it cause I'm not a fan of marbled grey.

Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 12:11 pm

kfunque wrote:

I'm a huge type/font nerd

well hello there

Joined: 08 Dec 2005 Posts: 9009 Location: SOMEWHERE EXTREME

actually now that I think of it, I prefer Ryan's new Mr. Tusks shirt
sorry, Malki !

Joined: 19 Jul 2005 Posts: 5828 Location: Los Angeles, CA

thew wrote:

I-I didn't want to say anything before...but yeah, the fonts didn't work for me on that poster.

Frankly they're not my favorite fonts either but that's the price we pay for verisimilitude! That is my hard-line attitude that may or may not be reasonable.

and ryan's new shirt is a TINY bit more adorable than mine I will admit

Joined: 11 Aug 2008 Posts: 5

I'd like to bring to your attention the mistakes in the new shirt's Russian; specifically, in the 'right there in the center' part; even more specifically, the word for 'right.'

On the shirt, you have right translated as srazu. In the phrase right now, this would be the correct translation, but in all other cases, srazu is translated as immediately.
In other words, the new shirt answers the question 'Where's my elephant?' with 'immediately there in the center.' And if that sounds awkward in English, it's much more so in Russian.

Instead, may I suggest replacing srazu with von, as in von tam, meaning over there. (The board mangles Cyrillic characters, but you can see the phrase here.)

Of course, there are good reasons to keep the new shirt as it is: the ironists may well appreciate it.

Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 1:15 pm

You should keep it wrong. Kinda like a Russian version of Engrish.

Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 1:27 pm

Russel: http://www.truthandbeautybombs.com/bb/viewtopic.php?t=16113

Joined: 19 Jul 2005 Posts: 5828 Location: Los Angeles, CA

Russel wrote:

I'd like to bring to your attention the mistakes in the new shirt's Russian; specifically, in the 'right there in the center' part; even more specifically, the word for 'right.'

On the shirt, you have right translated as srazu. In the phrase right now, this would be the correct translation, but in all other cases, srazu is translated as immediately.
In other words, the new shirt answers the question 'Where's my elephant?' with 'immediately there in the center.' And if that sounds awkward in English, it's much more so in Russian.

Instead, may I suggest replacing srazu with von, as in von tam, meaning over there. (The board mangles Cyrillic characters, but you can see the phrase here.)

Of course, there are good reasons to keep the new shirt as it is: the ironists may well appreciate it.

Russel: thanks for the tip. Is there no better Russian equivalent of "right there" than "over there"? "Over there" doesn't have quite the same ring, as it seems (in English anyway) to imply distance. Whereas "right there" implies that it's obvious, which is the intended connotation.

Perhaps "simply there"? Unfortunately I am not terribly familiar with Russian idioms!

I appreciate your help!

Joined: 11 Aug 2008 Posts: 5

darthkittenlover wrote:

Russel: thanks for the tip. Is there no better Russian equivalent of "right there" than "over there"? "Over there" doesn't have quite the same ring, as it seems (in English anyway) to imply distance. Whereas "right there" implies that it's obvious, which is the intended connotation.

Perhaps "simply there"? Unfortunately I am not terribly familiar with Russian idioms!

I appreciate your help!

I see what you mean about it implying distance. It's actually the tam (2nd word) that does that. You could replace it with tut (or zdes'), both of which literally mean here, but this would break the idiom and sound awkward too.

There are still many ways of translating the phrase, but after mentioning it to a couple of others, I've decided that the best text would be vot on, v zentre* (here he [is], in the center). It has the style and subtext similar to the "original" English, and vot implies proximity, like what you were asking for.

Glad to be helpful!

* As you know, the board doesn't show Cyrillic, but here's the text in Unicode (all lower-case): вот он, в центре

Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 11:36 pm

The elephant's situation makes me uncomfortable!